Page 3 of Self driving cars and morality

General Forum

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Snaps (Elite) posted this on Tuesday, 20th March 2018, 02:48

Quote:
bandicoot says...
"I wonder how many fatalities will be required before we realise sensors failing to detect on self driving cars, Kills."


Your post from another thread
Quote:
This is why I want to know the real facts first before accusing anyone, assuming that we ever get them.


Snaps



My new Flash Fiction blog. All my own work
500ish




I am not young enough to know everything.

Liked by: bandicoot

RE: Self driving cars and morality

bandicoot (Elite) posted this on Tuesday, 20th March 2018, 12:15

Quote:
Snaps says .....Mark this one down in the calendar.
I agree with Bandi.

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Robee J Shepherd (undefined) posted this on Thursday, 22nd March 2018, 13:53

So this looks like two things...

  1. Pedestrian was crossing the road in the dark, oblivious to oncoming traffic, almost no human driver would have seem them and been able to break in time to avoid a collision
  2. Automonous vehicle should surely have detected this invisible danger with LIDAR and breaked?

Editor
MYREVIEWER.COM

My Flickr Photostream

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Snaps (Elite) posted this on Thursday, 22nd March 2018, 17:36

Having now seen it I'd agree with 2. but even on 1. I'd argue a human driver would have braked soon enough to reduce the impact.

Snaps



My new Flash Fiction blog. All my own work
500ish




I am not young enough to know everything.

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Si Wooldridge (Reviewer) posted this on Thursday, 22nd March 2018, 18:19

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/tempe-breaking/2018/03/21/video-shows-moments-before-fatal-uber-crash-tempe/447648002/

"It's very clear it would have been difficult to avoid this collision in any kind of mode (autonomous or human-driven) based on how she came from the shadows right into the roadway," Tempe Police Chief Sylvia Moir told the San Francisco Chronicle after viewing the footage.

On the other hand, it's clear that the human driver was paying attention, but you could argue the point of that if the car is driving.  Also not sure why the car would be doing 40mph in a 35mph zone...


---------

Si Wooldridge
Reviewer

http://synth.myreviewer.com

RE: Self driving cars and morality

bandicoot (Elite) posted this on Friday, 23rd March 2018, 12:52

The fundamental pholosophy of self driving cars is working sensors to watch all round, and from anyone that owns a car knows that failures of components in cars can happen anytime. 

At least a human can usually spot something going wrong with his car, and can pull in if need be.

The problem also with sensors, is that they cannot see the unexpected, for example one episode on the road I saw a deer far off in a field running towards me at 90 degrees to the car, and I knew by its trajectory  it was going to jump the fence onto the road just when I reached it. So I braked in advance, and the deer got across the road, and we were both safe. There is no way sensors could respond to that situation, and there lies the problem with these self aware cars.

We are going to see far more of these sensor faults or sensors slow to respond. It just pure madness having theses cars.

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Robee J Shepherd (undefined) posted this on Friday, 30th March 2018, 21:03

Bandi, some of what you say makes sense, but most of it shows how technology works is magical to you. An automotive vehicle will struggle with things like a deer jumping over the fence, but it would also know immediately if it's sensors had failed.

Cars for years have been able to let you know when a light bulb has blown, and that doesn't have a microchip in it. They know when modern sensors fail within a few microseconds at most, and then light up the dashboard and make you pay a few hundred pounds to your dealer to get them replaced.

In 99.9% of situations a computer is going to do a lot better and faster job than any human at reacting, but they'll still kill people in the long run, just way fewer than humans do.

We still don't know why the car didn't see the pedestrian, although there are now videos on the net of people driving the same route and showing that it isn't as dark as the released footage looks, and also people who have enhanced the released footage to easily show a pedestrian if there were visual image processing looking for one.

The problem is, this isn't a production car, this is a beta (maybe alpha?) version, and anyone who has ever run that kind of software will know it has bugs. It's just the bugs here are potentially more dangerous than in Microsoft Office.

Various recent things going badly for Uber here:
https://mashable.com/2018/03/29/uber-self-driving-fatal-crash/#EklTi5E9cgqF


Editor
MYREVIEWER.COM

My Flickr Photostream

RE: Self driving cars and morality

bandicoot (Elite) posted this on Friday, 30th March 2018, 22:29

My opinion is that self driving cars will be fine on their own dedicated roads, preferably on a track of one way single roads, away from human driver cars, animals, and pedestrians, and other such targets.

Blackpool pleasure Beach had the right idea, Like this 

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Si Wooldridge (Reviewer) posted this on Saturday, 31st March 2018, 07:23

So we'll turn all our roads into a giant scalextric track?

---------

Si Wooldridge
Reviewer

http://synth.myreviewer.com

RE: Self driving cars and morality

Robee J Shepherd (undefined) posted this on Saturday, 31st March 2018, 08:52

Quote:
Si Wooldridge says...
"So we'll turn all our roads into a giant scalextric track?"

Looking at how some humans drive, maybe simplifying the controls is a good thing...

...Just remembered how some humans take corners in Scalextric. :(


Editor
MYREVIEWER.COM

My Flickr Photostream

Liked by: bandicoot

Go back to General Forum threads, or All Forum threads